Isn't killing in the name of a god an explanation for madness?

So I just want to raise a conversation between religious life and atheism. You might know that im an atheist and have been for 3 months now but the process has been going on since I was 14. Last drop was when my close friend committed suicide. Then I...

quit my beliefs in god and the bible. I dont want to insult any of the religions out there.
But I think that religion can and will make you unable to think reasonably in most cases because for example the christianitys ten commandments defy each other. An example: If a psychopath would come to your door and he/she was looking for your husband/wife and the person would be around the house but hiding. So would you lie? Or literally get your spouse killed? Both are in the ten commandments "Thy shall not kill" and "Thy shall not lie". As another fact christianity and islamist groups have recently been to war with eachother, and Bush said that god had spoken to him and given the order to attack and so do the islamist groups kill people in the name of their god. So, I want to ask this. Isn't killing people in the name of a god a fitting explanation for madness??

I'm in a third camp here - neither atheist nor pro-Bush. Don't get so caught up in the old way things have been in America, as to imagine that Christians all round the world are right wing or pro-Bush or pro-Iraq war or whatever. It's just the way things became in America for a while, although I gather even that's changing now. So, for the record, I'm an evangelical Christian who lives in Europe, votes centre left and wasn't pro war.

Is 'killing in the name of God an explanation for madness, in my opinion? Yes. It's also normally an excuse - people have other motives for war and then sometimes tack a religious reason onto it. There have been wars which have seemed religious in origin, but mostly wars are to do with tribalism, greed, fear of change etc.

Thus, you don't have to become an atheist simply because you reject the way Christianity has been in America over the last few decades. All groups of Christians have bad points and good points, and if we get too focused on one political dimension of our faith, in my opinion we give others a very bad understanding of Jesus.

To your original question, which is a good ethical dilemma (over the issues of lying to save a life), I would say that God gives us intelligence and discretion to make choices in his name. So to me, telling a lie to save a life is right - look at Oskar Schindler, who saved many Jews in Germany by any means possible.

The two commandments you mention are, as far as the translations I've looked at:
“You shall not murder.
and
You shall not give false testimony against your neighbour."

Thus it's not lying as such which is banned, but lying in order to get someone into trouble. Quite the opposite to lying to save a life, so I don't see any ethical conflict there.

As far as suicide goes - yes, it really does shake your faith. A friend of mine killed herself shortly after getting married, and another one died in a possible suicide attempt while very depressed about work. No-one should say that your faith remains the same after something like that happens. I don't see is as a reason to give up on God, but it certainly did make me think things through, as you have been doing.

I'm not going to tell you to stop being an atheist, start being a Christian or anything like that. You have to make up your own mind. But try to look widely to find out the long-term picture, rather than getting blinded to what Christianity can mean, by some of the things you see its followers doing.

Indeed.
People are always talking about how God told them to do what they've done.
But honestly in the matter of killing for a God, I think it's just an excuse.
Once you put God into anything, so many will automatically follow.

In my personal opinion religion is a lost cause.
One that seems to try and justify all our mistakes.

Nice to see im not alone in atheism

Definately not =)

well of course I wouldnt want to insult anyone but in my OPINION I think religion is just a state of mind people look to for an easy explanation to everything their is.
I wouldnt want to say that I am an atheist yet,...but I also refuse to see that religions give you limits on what you can and cannot do.

I was baptized catholic (which I still am) but I simply refuse to practice it simply becauses we are told to follow the 10 commandments.
I say we should live the way we want to NOT HOW WE ARE TOLD

I agree with that too.

I just dont think that commandments in a man written book should be classified as godly.
Honestly, I just think its another way to control and sedate a series of people.
Pure control.

I'm an atheist too.I like being able to live the way I want too - I agree with you xarix. Why should there be religions for a whole set of people. We should have our own religion - our own set of rules. I suppose some people like being controlled and that's why they're not atheists. I don't like being told what to do, and I hate rules. All about rebellion =P

x

I remember when I quit believing in God at 12. The only other atheist I ever heard of was Madalyn Murray O'Hair and everyone I knew seemed to hate her. I thought atheists were perhaps one in a million in America. Only after going to college and finding the Atheism section in my college library did I realize that there were in fact millions of Atheists in America and it wasn't that uncommon.

Another example of people being unreasonable because of their religion is when children of Christian Scientists need blood transfusions. My wife is a nurse and they do the best to accomodate CS's wishes for no blood transfusions but when situations arise where a minor is in mortal danger without a blood transfusion they do get a court order so they can give blood inspite of the parents objection.

In my book allowing a child to die by refusing medical treatment is bad even if it is religiously motivated. If an adult wants to refuse a transfusion that would save their life that is fine but kids should have a chance to grow up.

Why the hell did they change the question's form, ffs...

It's simply an easy excuse or cover for being Evil - Satan is the great deciever who's destination is the Lake of Fire.

You said: "Bush said that god had spoken to him and given the order to attack" - never heard he stated that specifically - proof please...

A moment.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=mxmDczdjd8A&feature=related

There... I wouldn't lie.

I'd advice you all to see that clip on YouTube. To atleast now wake-up from the dream you've been having until now that Bush's goverment would be democratic or fair or legit.
I despise the people who try to make their causes right by using God as excuse.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=JARF7q2S6ns <--- WHY ARENT THAT KIND OF PEOPLE CONSIDERED AS MANIACS!! "a god warrior" PLEASE! I'm so pissed about religion being the f*cking easiest way out of a crime or whatever, no matter how cruel the deed may be.

God wouldn't tell anyone to kill, clearly its just an excuse for their evil, God made it clear in all of the holy books, there is no religion that allow killing,God is a mercy .

Reference the video:

I have no desire to argue this subject but this is hearsay - "He said" - it is not evidence from Bushs mouth, first hand - if that's proof enough for you, great...I neither believe or disbelieve - matters not to me - would not be acceptable in a court of law however...Take care !!

I think killing in the name of God is either insane or evil depending upon the state of mind of the murderer. However, let's not forget that we all can be irrational at times and we can go to great lengths to justify our beliefs. This is not exclusively a Christian problem - it's a human problem. It's very obvious to us atheists when Christians do it but I bet we'd be surprised how often we "rational" people do similar things.

Oh and welcome to the atheist family. It's a tough crowd to hang with but you'll learn a lot.

I dont think atheism is a tough crowd. I feel like I've found my own way.

I say that atheists are a tough crowd because the ones online tend to question everything and not suffer fools gladly. They are more likely to check references and pin you down if you're wrong. I find that stimulating but some find it intimidating. I'm glad that you are happy with what you've discovered.

You may be the only person flossheal who has really helped considering the question at hand.. But my faith in God has depleted. There was so much greed and distortion in the churches in the middle ages that Christian churches havent recovered yet.

I really cant help despising the people who practice religious activity for profit. I feel like the whole concept of religion has faded. I dont feel comfortable living in a corrupted society that for example doesnt allow women to be priests. What good is a religion if people arent treated as equals? Isn't the whole idea of religion that humans, women and men, can find mercy and understanding and such from it?

I personally feel that I'm being deceived by God or the church. Too much blood has been spilled in his name and the ways that christianity has been spread disgust me.
I think that christianity is a lost cause...